Subject: Kennedy Space Center Official and Senator Barry Goldwater
discussed UFO reality

    The following report comes from Clark McClelland, ScO, Kennedy Space
Center, FL, and reprinted with his permission.
    - Richard Boylan, Ph.D.
                            Senator Barry Goldwater
                            On UFOs, ETs And Roswell
       By Clark McClelland Former ScO, Space Shuttle Fleet Kennedy Space
            Center, Florida 1958 to 1992 c. 2006 All Rights Reserved

    The date of July 16, 1969 was the day of the launch of Apollo 11 and the
        initial kick-off for the first landing of the human race on our
     neighbor, the moon. The global importance of this major historic event
    was very evident at the Kennedy Space Center, Florida. It was Moon Shot

     Many famous people from all over the world gathered in the VIP launch
     viewing area near the Apollo LCC (Launch Control Center). The security
     was at its highest level with VIP guests present from every nation on
       earth. One guest was in attendance whom I had supported during his
    political career, Senator Barry M. Goldwater of Arizona. He had been the
      Republican Presidential candidate in 1964 running against President
    Lyndon B. Johnson. He had lost by a wide margin, but, we in Florida had
     delivered him a victory in Brevard County, Florida and the Space Port
      area and pride in ourselves regarding that minor accomplishment. In
            1968, Goldwater won back his Senatorial seat in Arizona.

      Senator Barry M. Goldwater was a former Major General in the United
    States Army Air Corp wanting to be a fighter pilot of a P-47 Thunderbolt
      and/or a P-51 Mustang aircraft, but was assigned to deliver various
       aircraft to combat areas. He had flown an estimated 160 plus other
    planes during his WW II and civilian years. I was also informed that he
    had been checked-out in an SR-71 Blackbird. That was VERY impressive to
    learn. Being a registered Democrat supporting a Republican candidate in
    Florida did not gain me any favor through my lifelong political party in
    Florida. I constantly lived with insults and jokes which supplemented my
      involvement in UFO research. McClelland has always been a maverick.

     During the long countdown of the Saturn V Apollo 11 launch vehicle, I
     took a breakfast break from the LCC and walked to the nearby VIP guest
      viewing site in hopes of meeting Senator Goldwater. As I scanned the
     numerous people gathered, I asked one of our security guards if he was
      aware of the location of Goldwater? He pointed his finger to an open
       field nearby saying "Do you see that guy over there setting up his
                 camera tripod, Mac? That's Senator Goldwater".

     I had my camera around my neck in hopes of having a photo opportunity
       with the Senator. I strolled across the crab grass turf as he was
    setting up his personal camera. I was surprised he was alone except for
        a half dozen other guests that were nearby also setting up their
    cameras. I introduced myself and he responded with a polite greeting. He
     asked if I was a guest in the VIP area. I chuckled a bit and said, no
    sir, I am not yet a VIP. He smiled, and said, yes, I know how you feel.
    I had the same experience in the past We talked about his earlier effort
       to gain the Presidency and I told him about my personal efforts in
      Brevard County. He thanked me saying at least he had won here in the
                                   Cape area.

    I seriously pondered my next question concerning UFOs and finally asked
     him if he would discuss the subject with me? I was surprised he had no
     Secret Service Agents or NASA Public Affairs personnel hovering around
       him. I explained my position at KSC and my being the NICAP Unit-3
      Director for Major Donald E. Keyhoe at KSC. He had met Keyhoe in DC
    years before. He approved our discussion on the UFO subject and we began
     our exchange of information. I began by saying it was obvious he had a
      deep abiding interest in UFOs and possible visits of alien races to
     earth. He said, "That is accepted fact in Washington and especially at
                           the Pentagon, young man."

    I had some understanding of his alleged statements regarding UFOs in the
    past and brought up the popular story of his effort to gain entry into a
    special storage area at Wright-Patterson AFB that purportedly had alien
    artifacts in it. He said, "Yes, that's the main event concerning me and
      UFOs. I was under the impression that a US Senator with a past as a
      Major General in the US Army Air Corp and a member of the US Senate
    Select Committee on Intelligence for many years would carry some weight
    in my allowances to enter such an area of military secrecy. I was rudely
     awakened to reality very swiftly when I was denied passage. It had me
        angry enough to discuss it with a personal friend of mine in the
       military and inquired why my position in the US Senate had no such

     My friend, General Curtis LeMay, Chairman of the Military Joint Chiefs
      of Staff at the Pentagon VERY angrily told me that I had no need to
    know. He gave me a lot of HELL about my activities at Wright-Patterson.
        He threatened to end our friendship for life! My God, Mac, that
       surprised the hell out of me." LeMay added, "you stay clear of our
    mutual friend, "Butch", too. (meaning General William "Butch" Blanchard)
    his having been at Roswell (later Walker) Army Air base and the 509Th.,
    will not gain you any favor for knowledge of that Roswell crash claim."

     Goldwater said, "Mac, Butch Blanchard was also a very valued friend of
    mine since WWII. He was the person who announced that a disc had crashed
     near Roswell in 1947. This cussing out did awaken me to one fact, that
    the UFO situation is the highest level of national secrecy. Much higher
    than the H-Bomb was and more than anything else that is known within the
     Pentagon, FBI, CIA, DIA, NSA, etc. That is, nothing is higher security
       than aliens being here on this planet. Then I realized Curtis was
    correct. And I never again approached him on the subject. That seemed to
       prove to me that UFOs were a fact, and do exist. But, are they all
      aliens? I highly suspect a majority are! Hell, they are no doubt far
                      ahead of our level of intelligence.

     The United States Air Force knows the truth, but will they ever reveal
     it to this nation?" I quickly said, "Yes, Senator, some UFOs sighted I
      have learned through the ONI are alien". His eyes brightened up and
    showed surprise saying, "Mac how would you know that as a fact and I was
     denied the truth?" I said " Senator, I was here, at KSC, and had also
     been at Cape Canaveral since the start of our national space program.
    With all due respect for your great accomplishments, sir, you were not.
      I've heard and seen things that without any doubt, proved to me that
                          UFO's and star races exist."

      I said, "Congress is not made aware of secrets of this caliber. The
    Pentagon controls such disclosures". He stared at me, then said: "Yes, I
    get your point. You were and are on the cutting edge of Technology Mac.
      Hell, you have seen events I can only dream about". I replied, "Yes,
                           sir, more than you know!"

     I then tested the Senator with another question. I asked him if he was
      at that time aware of the fact that several former German Scientists
    were assigned to Wright Field? He said, "No, Mac, I was not". Then, one
     of the nearby launch viewers came close to our location and I stopped
       the discussion. The man wanted to say hello and shake the hand of
    Senator Goldwater. Following his departure, I continued, saying, "Those
    Germans were at Wright since post-WWII and assigned to reverse engineer
      certain retrieved hardware that was suspected to be of alien origin.
        They accomplished that assignment of the object that crashed in
    Kecksburg, Pennsylvania. It was taken to Wright Field. Senator Goldwater
        said, "Yes, I recall that incident. What was it? Do you know?" I
    replied, "Yes, sir, it was a Soviet failed mission to Venus in 1965. It
    was not alien, Senator. The public was lead to believe it was a UFO. Far
    easier to explain than a missile from the USSR hitting within the USA".
                               Goldwater agreed.

    Goldwater asked if I was aware of who the Germans were? I replied, "Yes,
      one was Siegfried Knemeyer, the former head of the German RLM ( The
    Reichsluftfahrtministerium), the Third Reich's Air Ministry for aircraft
     development for the Luftwaffe. He died in 1979 in the USA. Another was
     Dr. Hans Amtmann, an expert in vertical take off aircraft. One other I
     am familiar is Dr. Alexander Lippisch who was more so well known and a
      pioneer in tailless aircraft, the US Delta wing fighter, the F-102A
    Delta Dagger and an advanced design of a ground effect flying boat. I'm
     almost certain these men also did a reverse engineering on the object
      that crashed near Roswell, New Mexico". I could see that what i was
    telling the Senator may have had his mind in a spin. So, I slowed down.
    He said, "Mac, what are you doing here? We need people like you in DC".
                  I said that my place was right here at KSC.

     I noted the countdown clock was at two hours and twenty seven minutes
     prior to the launch of Apollo 11 and asked him if he would like a soft
     drink? He said: "Yeah, maybe a shot and a beer, after hearing all you
      have said, Mac". He laughed. I smiled and went for two Pepsi-Colas.

    When I returned, he continued the conversation saying: "Mac, you work in
     one of the most secretive and important areas of our national security
    on the cutting edge of space science and are no doubt aware of much that
     has and is happening during our missions into space". I confirmed his
          statement saying I was also part of an ONI (Office of Naval
     Intelligence) unit at Patrick Air Force Base South of the Cape. He was
     surprised to hear that fact. He said, "So, you are Naval Intelligence,
    young man?" I said, "Well, yes sir, but, only one member". He continued,
    making certain none of the people nearby was within listening distance,
    "Now, may I ask you what you have heard or seen here?" I joked with him
        and said "Do you have a need to know, sir" and we both laughed.

     Goldwater smiled while he adjusted his camera tripod. Soon, a man and
     woman wondered by saying hello and we both similarly replied. I asked
     the man if he would take a photo of Goldwater and I together. I asked
     approval of the Senator and he gave his OK. Following the photo being
    taken, I thanked both the people, they shook the hand of the Senator and
       they went on their way. I was disappointed and noted after it was
      developed that the photo had been taken too distant to show both our
          faces in more detail. But, it does show enough recognition.

     I asked the Senator if he knew Senator Richard Russell of the State of
     Georgia? He snapped back, "Are you kidding, Mac? Of course I know Dick
        Russell". Goldwater then softly ask me if I was aware of Senator
      Russell's UFO sighting in the Soviet Union?" I smiled and said "Yes,
                   sir. I learned of it through my ONI Unit"

    He said, "Now, do you have the proper clearances, Mac?" with a smile. I
     told him my clearance level. He said, "That was more than acceptable",
       and again smiled. He continued, "I had heard a rumor about Russell
    having his UFO experience, and thought I would approach him about it. I
              was careful not to have him cuss me out like LeMay.

     I'll tell you what he and I discussed. About six or seven years ago in
    1962, before my election loss to Johnson in1964, Dick and I got together
       after a Senate meeting and sat alone in his office. Dick said that
      around sundown on 4 October 1955, he saw two separate saucer shaped
    crafts while traveling on a train through the Soviet Union on his way to
    Czechoslovakia. He made a small sketch of the object for us to study on
    his desk pad. He showed a sparkle flashing under its base and indicated
    it had two lights on its top portion that remained stationary, while the
    outer section of each disc appeared to revolve or spin. He said it had a
      slight yellowish color and may have been 25 to 35 feet in diameter.
    After talking about the object for about five minutes, Russell tore the
     desk pad drawing off his sketch pad and placed it in his jacket pocket
     for later burning. He told me that it was classified Top Secret by the
      FBI and military. He did not want the sketch to end up in the wrong

      Goldwater told me that Russell then detailed how he watched from his
    train window as one saucer-shaped craft was seen to rise slowly from the
    ground about 2 miles away and flew over his train at not too high a rate
     of speed. It was estimated to be between 5 to 6,000 feet in altitude.
       Goldwater emphasized, "Mac, Dick was so excited about this actual
         viewing of a UFO that he tried to summon his Russian language
       interpreter, Ruben Efron who arrived too late and had only a brief
     sighting of the object. His aid was Colonel Hathaway (later, I learned
    he was U. S. Army Colonel, E. U. Hathaway, the military aid-de-camp for
                  the U..S. Senate Armed Services Committee).

    Goldwater said that Russell was not able to alert Ruben quickly for him
      to have only a brief sighting of the initial craft, but, he, Colonel
    Hathaway and Ruben all witnessed the second disc in detail. Russell said
       the CIA and FBI, and perhaps the NSA were apparently briefed in DC
      concerning this very important event and had a US Air Force officer
    interview Russell, Ruben and Colonel Hathaway in Europe. Goldwater could
    not recall the US Air Force Officers name. Later I gained that data and
       discovered it was Lt. Colonel, Thomas Ryan who prepared a detailed
         report on the sighting for the Pentagon. The report was highly
    classified and was not made public until the excellent work of Dr. Bruce
     Maccabee, Chairman of the Fund for UFO Research obtained the documents
       through the Freedom of Information Act It was not declassified for
          public viewing until 1985! Thirty years after the incident.

    Goldwater said, "Mac, it makes one wonder why objects that do not exist,
    according to the USAF, require such TOP Secrecy by the US Government?" I

    Note: In February 2006, The Bush Administration once again reclassified
      at least 55,000 former secret and confidential documents. Once again
       they were not to be released to the public through the Freedom of
    Information Act. What caused the highly secretive Bush Administration to
     reverse that decision? What is Bush, Chaney, Rumsfeld, Rice, etc., now
     keeping from the general knowledge of the tax paying public? Makes one
                                seriously think!

    I continued our exchange, saying, "Senator, when I first arrived at Cape
    Canaveral in 1958, the initial mystery event I became aware of was what
      RCA Engineers called Lonesome George! I later was informed by those
    personnel that they had accidentally discovered an orbiting, what could
     be called, alien space probe out at the distance of the moon. Senator,
     remember that the USA and USSR had not orbited any man made object at
      the time they initially discovered the object. What was its purpose,
        negative or positive concerning the safety of the human race? It
       apparently was not showing any harmful intent towards the earth".
      Goldwater did show amazement at my disclosure and admitted having no
                            knowledge of the object.

    I then related I was also aware of several Mercury, Gemini and other UFO
      sightings by astronaut crews. That statement seemed to light up the
     Senators eyes. He asked, "What did they observe?" I continued, "During
    our Mercury Program, I heard the voice of Astronaut Gordon Cooper during
     his Mercury 9 mission report a "green colored object" that appeared to
       be passing his capsule in the opposite orbital direction over the
      Pacific Ocean in 1963. Many years later, I spoke with Gordo during a
    phone conversation and asked him if he would elaborate? He denied it was
     a fact and said he did not see an object during Mercury 9. But, I had
     heard him say he was tracking such an object? He quickly added, we are
    on a phone Slim (My nickname used by several of the earlier astronauts).
                           He caught me by surprise".

    The Senator asked me why? I said, "I suspected that Gordo was giving me
    a message. He apparently had suspicion his phone was not secure. Maybe I
     was incorrectly making that judgment, but, that was my analysis of his
    statement. Senator, now to elaborate on the Mercury 9 mission. I was at
     the Mercury Mission Control facility here at Cape Canaveral on the day
     of the return to earth by Cooper. I had initially tried to visit USAF
       Colonel John A. "Shorty" Powers at Hangar "S" discovering that the
      Colonel was at mission control South of the hangar area and I drove
     there to see him. He had my special Mercury 9 lapel pin, a memento of
                             this historic mission.

        Having security clearance, I entered the mission control area. I
       immediately heard communications between Mercury 9 and the Cap Com
        (Capsule Communication) officer, Astronaut Wally Schirra who was
     tracking Cooper and the Faith 7 across the Pacific Ocean on it's final
    pass prior to splash down in that same area on its next pass. It was the
    final orbit of Faith Seven before reentry back to earth. The commentary
    was on an open PA system at mission control. Following the disclosure of
        Cooper that he was observing a "green colored object", and other
      comments that were made by Astronaut Scott Carpenter who was in the
    Kauai, Hawaii tracking station concerning it. Senator, Cooper was on his
      third orbit and had released a highly luminous 6 inch diameter Xenon
      Strobe Light sphere to test his tracking capabilities of the object
       while on orbit. He finally was able to see it on his fourth orbit.
       Senator, I wonder if the object he saw was connected to that Xenon
       Strobe Light? But, it was not green and not in the proper orbital

    "Senator, I believe he actually did see a UFO. Sir, Cooper has disclosed
     to me that he had chased UFOs during his USAF duties in 1951 while in
     Germany. He said they out maneuvered his flight of F-86 Sabre jets and
    were flying at a greater speed than our airplanes. Goldwater said: "Yes,
    Mac, I'm aware of that fact." I continued, "Are you aware that Astronaut
    Gordon Cooper was later bumped from the Apollo 14 lunar landing mission
     by NASA? Goldwater said: "Mac, I also recall that fact". "Yes sir, he
               was" I replied. "Why? Were there hidden reasons?"

    Goldwater again asked? "Sir, Gordo enjoyed racing, he loved controlling
         a fast vehicle, like most of those earlier astronauts. He was
        considering entering a big car race in Daytona Beach against the
     objections of NASA. He was warned by NASA to stay clear of any race in
     Daytona. They had spent a lot of money training him and were not going
      to have an car accident impact their critical lunar launch schedule.
     Gordo was angered by that refusal. NASA realized he was still planning
     on entering a race, so they finally assigned that Apollo 14 mission to
                                 Alan Shepard.

    Following that incident, it was all down hill for Gordon Cooper and his
    NASA astronaut career. Gordo was bitter about that up to the day of his
     death. Senator, you may recall that Gordon Cooper became involved with
     the United Nation's efforts to have the subject of UFOs brought before
     the UN and to have it finally disclosed that unknown crafts are being
    encountered all over the earth. I believe Cooper knew secrets about UFOs
    he kept from disclosing to the public at that time. I personally believe
    he was threatened with the loss of his retirement if he would not remain
      quiet. His interest in UFOs also may have impacted his NASA career."

      Goldwater then asked about sightings during other space missions. I
     mentioned several during Gemini and Apollo and then I asked him if he
    had heard anything about a 1956 US Naval aircraft and the huge UFO that
    many crew member and others observed over the Atlantic Ocean? He said he
     had not. I said, "I was not surprised. Senator, it apparently was also
      kept secret by the Pentagon as that incident of Senator Russell. My
     initial muster (US Naval term for a meeting) with the US Navy ONI Unit
      6-69 at Patrick AFB, Florida was in early 1959. I was introduced to
         several highly ranked officers (admirals, captains, etc.) who
     immediately swore me to secrecy, Bible and all, concerning what I was
    about to presently view and other data I would experience in the future
    concerning confidential and secret information. I agreed and volunteered
                to operate the group movie and slide projector.

    My being an investigator of UFOs, and a member of NICAP, for many years
      was apparently well known by this group of US Naval Officers. I had
         presented talks on the subject of Space Flight and UFOs at the
      Philadelphia Naval Base a few years prior, and was presently seeking
      additional UFO encounters within the space program. I realized that
     would be my value to the unit along with my friendship with many NASA
    Astronauts to this ONI Unit. Captain Rudy Bergholz, a technical manager
    at NASA KSC, opened a large film canister and handed it to me. The film
    can was marked, confidential with other taped notes of instructions and

    I began rolling the film and I found it to be an amazing disclosure of a
    UFO incident that occurred in 1956. The officers were excitingly talking
    among themselves as it described the sighting of a huge disc shaped UFO
        (400 feet in diameter) by a US Naval flight crew in a Navy R7V-2
     transport, which was a four engine Super-Constellation traveling West
       over the Atlantic Ocean towards Gander, Newfoundland. An apparent
      refueling stop for its eventual landing at the Naval Air Station at
     Patuxant, Maryland. (Note: A base where several astronaut crews would
    eventually be trained for secret DoD missions, STS-48, UFOs etc. during
                         future Space Shuttle Program).

      I immediately noted a familiar name, Admiral Delmar S. Fahrney being
     mentioned in the film. Goldwater injected a comment, "Yes, I have met
    Admiral Fahrney, Mac." I said," Yes, sir" I continued, "Another comment
      was made in the film recognizing NICAP and Major Donald E. Keyhoe, a
    former US Marine fighter pilot". I asked the Senator if he knew Keyhoe?
    He said, "Yes, I have met him. A very impressive man". I commented that
        I wondered why I had not heard about this case prior to this ONI
                 meeting, perhaps from NICAP in Washington DC?

      Captain Bergholz said I had not yet been approved to have a "need to
    know" by the US Navy. Apparently, now I had that need, but, why? During
       the meeting, Captain Bergholz finally sprung the reason, I was to
         investigate and verify through those German Scientists at Cape
    Canaveral, who those Paper Clip Scientists were that had come to the USA
    with Dr. Wernher von Braun in 1946 and who had been assigned to the AMC
      (Air Material Command) Foreign Technology Division at Wright Field,
      Ohio? Bergholz being my commanding officers delegated the job to me
    because of my association with many German Scientists at Cape Canaveral.
      I later informed Burgholz that I had discovered at least three Paper
       Clip Scientists that were assigned to Wright Field following their
    arrival with Dr.Wernher von Braun. One named Siegfried Knemeyer, former
              Third Reich Luftwaffe Pilot and RLM Director, - - -

     "Senator Goldwater interrupted me, and said, "Mac, what's RLM? I told
    him it was the German Air Ministry that created the various planes, like
     the Messerschmitt, Junker, and may have influenced the the V-1 and V-2
     rockets at Peenemunde. I continued, two other Paper Clip scientists at
    Wright Field are Dr. Hans Amtmann and Dr. Alexander Lippisch. I believe
    all three are still at Wright-Patterson Air Force base, Senator. Perhaps
     you can try and contact them there." The Senator quickly replied, "No,
              not after that experience with General LeMay, Mac!"

      I said " Senator, you are aware of the military rivalry to gain the
    upper hand over other areas of the United States military that has been
    an on-going practice throughout our national history". He replied, "Yes,
    I am, having been associated with the military budgets in the Senate". I
    continued saying, "There was and still is a great rivalry between the US
     military services and since the USAF and the US Army ABMA were playing
       the same game between them at Wright Field, the AMC (Air Material
      Command) Foreign Technology Division of the USAF had captured alien
       technology and the US Navy wanted it shared with the ONI. Another
     habitual US Military squabble. Can you imagine the Soviet Union having
     such squabbles? Not on your life. Admirals and General would have been
    marched to a wall and executed. In fact, Stalin did just that to several
                  of his military officers. Goldwater agreed.

      I continued to explain the film, "As we all watched the ONI film, it
    described the sighting of a huge 400 foot or larger saucer shaped object
       that was encountered by a US Navy R7V-2 four engine Constellation
     aircraft over the Atlantic Ocean. As many as 40 military personnel and
     air crew observed it as it approached the aircraft and appeared to be
     observing the Navy plane. It was at an altitude of about 19 to 20,000
    feet and at first the object was mistaken for being a gathering of many
    ships below the plane due to its size when initially and earlier viewed
     far below the aircraft by the navigator and commander of the plane. I
     said, Senator Goldwater, I cannot recall the names of the flight crew.
     He said, "Just continue with the incident, Mac. It's very interesting
     and I was not aware it had happened". I continued, "They all witnessed
         it and described it as having a large illuminated outer ring.

        Since it and what some said may have been other craft below were
     possibly seen. As the large object approached the plane at about 1,000
    yards those aboard were mystified and frightened. The crew later said it
     was a huge saucer shaped metallic machine." Goldwater asked, "Mac, did
                 they show photographs of it in the ONI film ?"

      I told him I was not aware that a film was exposed during the actual
      incident, so, no, I did not see any depiction of the UFO. If any UFO
           film, was taken at all, it was apparently under Top Secret
    classification and not shown in the ONI film. Some comments made by the
       crew in the film were that they all considered the huge object was
    "intelligently controlled". They also said that no living creature, etc,
      was seen. They added that the crafts speed from when it climbed from
      near sea level to their aircraft altitude was estimated to be about
    1,400 to 2,000+ knots in a brief time lapse of seven to eight seconds."
        The Senator said, "That's astounding, Mac! What else was said?"

     I continued, "The Navy aircraft commander radioed ahead to the Gander
     Air Force Base control tower and asked if their radar was identifying
    any other object near his R7V-2? The tower control officer said, yes, a
       larger object and in close proximity of the Navy plane. Sir, they
     verified that gigantic craft was on their radar!" He replied, "Mac, I
     was not aware of that case! I will try and pursue it when I return to
        Washington". I replied, "Contact Don Keyhoe or Richard Hall, his
       deputy". I continued with the sighting saying, "The US Navy flight
     Commander asked the USAF interviewer at Gander during their individual
      and group debriefing was asked by the interrogator, did they see any
        indication of life? His reply was, no, but it was intelligently
       controlled, and my crew and I are all witnesses to that fact! That
       object was not remotely controlled, something inside of it was in
     CONTROL! The interrogator would not discuss what the Gander Radar had
    recorded and refused to allow the Navy to review it. The Navy Commander
     asked the Air Force Officer, what's the USAF up to now? You people say
      UFOs do not exist, what the hell did we see if they don't exist? The
       USAF Officer said, Sorry, we cannot answer any of your questions!

    I told the Senator that I suspected it was Dr. J. Alan Hynek who became
    involved about four or so days later after the US Navy aircraft arrived
       at Patuxant, Maryland and the crew was once again placed under an
     intense ONI interrogation with a detailed report from each crew member
     and those who were passengers returning home." Senator Goldwater then
     said, "What was the scientists response, Mac? I am very interested to
        know. I may contact Hynek and try to investigate if he were the
                scientist involved." I replied, "Good idea sir.

    Now to continue, the unidentified scientist asked the Navy Commander if
    he had any photographs of the huge UFO? The Commander said yes, but they
      have all been confiscated and classified. The scientist met with the
       Commander and unlocked a brief case and withdrew several photos of
      strange objects (UFOs). He asked the Commander if any were similar?
    While reviewing the photos, the Commander stopped and said, this is the
     exact saucer shaped object my crew and I saw. He then said, if you and
     the government have photos such as these, there are people within the
     Federal Government who know? The scientist said he was sorry, but., he
      could not disclose anything. Closed his briefcase and left the room.
     Senator, the facts concerning UFOs and if they are from an alien star
    race is known in DC!" Senator Goldwater then said, "Mac, I am absolutely
         going to look into this when I return to Washington tomorrow".

     I then asked the Senator if he would answer a few questions I had for
       him. He agreed. I asked him, "Are you aware of any facts that are
     unknown to the public regarding the alleged Roswell crash in 1947? He
      said: "Mac, I have investigated that incident through every possible
     agency that may have had some responsibility, the FBI (Hoover who shut
    me off quickly), The NRO, DIA, NSA, etc., and have gained nothing other
     than hell from the Pentagon. You may know more about it than I. I'm as
     curious about those facts as you. The reaction I have had from General
    LeMay and the on-site Roswell facts known by General "Butch" Blanchard,
      etc., has told me one thing that it did happen and is a major secret
         regarding UFOs and aliens of our time. Perhaps of all times".

    I looked at my watch and the NASA Countdown Clock a short distance from
         where we were and it was progressing without any launch holds.
    Excitement was rising with the VIP crowd. My break had run out. Senator
    Goldwater and I both shook hands and I thanked him for his openness with
        me. As I walked away, I glanced back at him and realized I would
     probably not talk with this great man in our nations history again. To
     me, Senator Barry Goldwater was a national treasure and great American

       I returned to the LCC. At 9:32 AM the liftoff of the huge Saturn V
    Apollo 11 rocket rumbled into space and a historic was realized. Mankind
    landed and returned from the moon and will continue to explore the vast
                 universe should our human existence continue.

    On 29 May 1998, Barry Goldwater passed away in Phoenix, Arizona. Perhaps
    he now knows the secrets of that " secret area" at Wright-Patterson Air
          Force Base and is now aware of other races among the stars.

                          Clark McClelland Former ScO,

         Space Shuttle Fleet Kennedy Space Center, Florida 1958 to 1992

                              Clark McClelland Former ScO